SPEAKER_01 0:14

Welcome to CCI Drivettime, the podcast for vended laundry distributors. I'm Steve with CCI using your drive time to cover laundromat trends, payment systems, and practical topics you can use in the field. Today I sat down and talked with Kevin Carlson. He is a VP of sales over at RJ Cool, covering uh parts of the Midwest. Kevin and I had a great conversation. Just another great example of a distributor who gets it, uh, who understands the business. He's been in he's been in this industry for 10 years, has observed a lot in that time, um, you know, has had opportunities to experience the things the distributors had, was really willing and gracious with sharing um some of the observations he's had over that time. So um here we go with Kevin Carlson. Kevin, how you doing today? I'm good, Steve. How are you doing? I am fantastic. Thank you so much for doing this. Uh we were just chatting before I hit the go button here that we haven't had a lot of time to interact with each other prior to this, but I'm looking forward to this conversation. I have done a little bit of homework on you through LinkedIn. I call it stalking, so I've I do it today. So I I but I want to hear it from you. You know, what I'd I'd love to start with, you just giving me a little bit of your background, you know, kind of how you got in the uh laundry industry, you know, and what brought you to where you are today.

SPEAKER_00 1:44

Yeah, so um I I did not grow up in this industry, didn't have any family in it. Um my background was actually in operations management and facility management. So uh, but I came into this business in 2016 uh in Anchorage, Alaska, and um I actually got the job through uh a recruiting firm. So um I was previously an operations manager with a chain of uh private health clubs. Uh you know, I had a hundred thousand square foot multi-sport facility, ran four departments, had 50 people that worked for me, and you know, my desk was the landing zone for all of the problems uh that happened on a day-to-day basis. Um this was in Alaska. Yes. Wow. Yeah. And uh, you know, it was a grind. Uh there's something wrong when you're working for a health and fitness company and you're gaining weight. You know, that's a that's a problem.

SPEAKER_01 2:40

Yeah, it's an interesting thing to be uh to be discussed about that. Yes, okay.

SPEAKER_00 2:44

Right. So um but yeah, I got in so I started out with a with a distributor base in Anchorage, Alaska, and uh, you know, I really used a lot of that facility management experience and found that having that perspective, being on that side of the table, really translated really well into the laundry business, and it was fascinating to me. You know, had no idea that this was even a thing. And um, so I was there for about I was doing that for about two years there, and really about halfway through, first clean show I went to was 2017, and that was an eye-opener for me. And really realized, okay, there's something here, I can probably do more, and probably can't do it in the state of Alaska. As beautiful as it is there, you know, ultimately the the it's just not there. Um and so I was actually having dinner one day with uh one of my factory reps and just mentioned, hey, do you know if you know a distributor in the lower 48 that's looking for someone that can come in, maybe help grow a sales team, grow a program, I'd be interested in talking to them. Um and then a couple months later I joined another small distributor in Omaha, Nebraska that did a lot more on the Venn side. Um was with them for six years and really learned a ton about the Venn side of the business. Uh we did we were really OPL heavy in Anchorage and then learning more about the Venn side. And again, you know, we we did a lot of good things there, but then really wanted to do more. And so uh ended up uh contacting Bill at RJ Cool, and then for the past two years I've been with them and just continuing to grow our territory market share in the Midwest.

SPEAKER_01 4:19

Yeah, that's an awesome story, and I really I'm I'm fond of uh Bill and RJ Cool and and certainly of the BDS acquisition that I know that occurred a number of years ago. That team is awesome. Um so it's it's great to see. We talked a little bit about kind of there's all this consolidation going on in the industry, but that kind of consolidation I kind of like. You know, kind of these two like kind of family-oriented businesses kind of joining forces and kind of just kind of taking on uh new territory and building it out. Um I love to see it. Um so you've been recently promoted, I guess, to vice president of sales with RJ Cool. Is that a fairly new thing for you?

SPEAKER_00 4:58

Uh it is, yeah. And so like with our company, when you go when you get that title, you really have ownership of more of a just a region within the Midwest. Okay. So when I first came with RJ Cool, I was doing just Nebraska, and now my vended territory has expanded into uh Missouri and Kansas as well.

SPEAKER_01 5:14

Okay, gotcha.

SPEAKER_00 5:15

So uh gotcha, gotcha.

unknown 5:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:18

So it's it's uh you're you're you're now responsible for a large territory. That's a lot of that's a lot of drive time. I mean, we talked about windshield time, that's uh that's a lot. So how are you how are you scheduling out your your time? Are you um do you have a pretty regimented schedule to hit customers or what do you how do you make it work?

SPEAKER_00 5:36

Well you really have to plan it out. Um you know, you and so what I like to do is if I know I'm going out to a certain area or region, maybe it's a little more rural, you know, reaching out to some of those folks ahead of time, saying, hey, I'm gonna be in your area. Um would love to talk to you if you can. If not, no problem, I may still stop by your facility. Like you really have to plan those things out. And then also, like any type of sales call or prospecting trip, things change quickly, or maybe someone doesn't show up. So figuring out, okay, I'm here, I thought I was gonna be here for two hours, it's 30 minutes through and we're done. What else can we do while we're in this area just to justify the time? So that's a huge part of it. You you have to do that because otherwise you find yourself scrambling and that gets awkward fast.

SPEAKER_01 6:23

Sure, sure. So I you know, kind of thinking about the the geography that you know that you serve, you know, there's there's gonna be a lot of rural areas in there, and you kind of mentioned that sometimes it takes some some time to get out there. Um, you know, I when I think of that, and I've I've had spent some time working with with folks that service more some of the rural areas. I have found, I'd be curious if what your opinion is that sometimes some of the best opportunities are in there because they're underserved. And people don't go there to check in on store owners and those business owners, but they are in need of everything that everybody else needs as well. Are you finding that to be true in your in your area?

SPEAKER_00 7:04

It's absolutely true. Um, one of the things that I hear more often than not is well, you came all the way out to see us, the least we can do is give you a few minutes of your of our time. And really, and the other part of that is a lot of these folks they don't know who to talk to or where to even go. Um and the other thing with those areas too is no one that's far away likes to be reminded that they're far away. It's you don't want to be okay. You know, you don't want to be like, well, I came, I drove all this way, you better talk to me. It's no, hey, no matter where you are, thanks for the time, let's see what we can do, and make sure that that time is effective. Um, and so you have to be knowledgeable on your product and how it can work in that area because they may only have so much time as well, and you're not gonna be casually going back and forth. Right. So really that setup and knowledge is make sure that that if it's only one visit, that they get everything they can out of it.

SPEAKER_01 8:04

Yeah. I I worked with a gentleman uh many years ago. I was early in the CCI days, and he's he invited me to go on a on a to spend the day with him on one of these long I didn't realize we were gonna be in the car together for like nine hours that day, but but you know, I thought we were gonna do a couple of service sales calls and and talk to some store owners, but the first stop was like six hours away. I was like, oh, okay, got it. Well, let's get in the car. So, you know, you get to know somebody pretty fast there. And and we got a chance to talk about him servicing a lot of rural markets. And one of the things that he it always has stuck with me for all these years is this idea goes at that time he was at he was a little bit he was telling this story about being a younger salesman, and somebody wanted to buy like three toploaders. I mean, this is a a lot of years ago, and he would drive like five hours to go meet them, to talk to them about selling them, you know, three or four top loaders, a small sale for the amount of drive time that's involved in that. But he would drive anywhere, he didn't care what they wanted to buy, if they were interested, he would go there. And it and it kind of and that then he tells the story that then every time and they were so impressed that he would come all the way out there to deal with this kind of what many would consider a small sale or an opportunity, that they became instantly loyal to him. And so they weren't always gonna only need a couple of machines, they were gonna need a refit someday, a whole row of dryers someday, and there was nobody else that they were gonna connect to. So this idea that just because the opportunity that's right in front of you may not be massive does not mean that there's not massive opportunity behind it at some point, and you really can't look at every small deal as an annoyance, it has to be looked at as an opportunity. Any any similar experiences on your end?

SPEAKER_00 9:48

It's yeah, that's I have that same experience all the time. And really, in these smaller towns, more rural areas, you know, word travels fast. And so the yeah, that small top-load deal may turn into well, that guy liked you, and he calls his friend that owns this business, or this person that owns that business, and then they already have the recommendations, so that conversation from the get-go is just a lot more comfortable. They already have talked to someone that likes you, trusts you, and respects you. So yeah, that that's huge.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

Yeah, that's awesome. That's awesome, and I think um that's something that we all can learn from a little bit. We all get, you know, we we all are trying to balance our time and we want to we we want to we want to work the bigger deals because you know they're they get they turn into something short-term, but we can't ignore this idea that every deal can turn into a big deal in some manner, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:43

Right. Well, and one of the things I love really about small towns too is if you're going in and you're maybe not sure where to go, where to start, there's usually a gas station or really an auto park store where people in the town are hanging out drinking coffee.

SPEAKER_01 10:58

Yeah. Yeah. And if you're not gonna be able to do it. You can learn a lot from that, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:02

You can walk in and you can just ask, hey, who who owns this, or who, or I'd like to look for this person, do you know who that is? And nine times out of ten, they'll tell you.

SPEAKER_01 11:11

Yeah. They've been waiting for somebody to come in and ask them questions about stuff they know.

SPEAKER_00 11:15

Oh my goodness, you're somebody else. We don't have to talk to the same 20 people.

SPEAKER_01 11:22

Well, I think one of the things that we've just kind of, you know, I mean we review is this idea of what of what separates, you know, I think a good salesperson from somebody that's not. I'm curious in your years now, what are the other traits that you think may make for a good distributor, a good salesperson in this business? What are the other things you think have led to some success for you?

SPEAKER_00 11:42

Yeah, well, really the big thing is having a process and having and developing that process to where it really feels very conversational, but you're still working through certain steps, and it's very easy, you know, to go off on a tangent, but being able to pivot back to that is really important. But really, and being a resource and being more than you know, quote, just a salesperson, um understanding more about utilities, um, you know, dimensional clearances, what all all the things that are needed to make our equipment actually work. And that I found brings so much more value is because in these scenarios, especially in smaller towns, it's likely the uh the customer's electrician's gonna call you, the plumber's gonna call you. And you don't need to be an expert, but just knowing some of those simple things and anticipating what they are going to need makes a huge difference in that sale.

SPEAKER_01 12:39

Yeah. I I think what you're what you're digging into here is is also something that um many don't realize the distributor's responsibility is is beyond just delivering a machine and providing statistics about a machine and providing the features, but everything, all the mechanicals that make that machine actually be successful, you have to kind of understand the HVAC requirements, the electric, the plumbing, the gas requirement, all of these things all go into making this thing work right. And so, you know, an electrician in a smaller town may have never installed a washing, you know, the utilities for a laundromat before, and they need a resource to go to who else is that guy? So having some familiarity with that, probably from experience, has probably come in handy.

SPEAKER_00 13:25

Yeah, absolutely. And and that exact scenario happens all the time where it's not a large electrical contractor, it's you know, Jim's Sparky house. And you know, Jim's never done a laundromat before, but you know, he has the knowledge, and we can give him spec sheets all day, but also hey, here's how the here's what you need to do on your end. So when we do bring this in, it does work.

SPEAKER_01 13:49

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and and that's that's that's twofold. That's not only just helping that electrician do a good job, but it is being saying your your likelihood on install day is just gonna you're just more likely gonna get the results that the customer's expecting out of that. So it's uh it's uh uh it's it's worth the effort to get familiar with with that piece of the of the business. Um what about relationships? Have you found that you've been able to forge relationships beyond just the sale and how has that aided or provided influence on uh you know future opportunities?

SPEAKER_00 14:25

Yeah, and you know, I have a little bit different take on how relationships that what works for me. Um I'm not necessarily trying to develop a relationship to get invited to someone's birthday party. Um I'm ultimately a bit of a private person, but I found with that relationship building, you don't you're not necessarily trying to be their best friend, but you need to build something that shows that you're a resource. And you know, one thing I really took uh from my days as an operations manager was you know, laundry equipment at any given point in time was one of probably 30 different things that I'm trying to work through. And when I'm talking to the person about that, you know, I'm not necessarily looking for the to be dazzled, I'm just looking for the information so I can check this off my list and move on with my day. And I found that you know people tend to respect that a little bit more in this area of like, hey, um, I just need to talk to someone. Can you give me, can you help me out with these things so I can continue my process? You don't want to slow them down. Sure. Um, yeah. So so that's I've found a lot more success in that way than really trying to play golf with everyone. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:35

You know what? I'm actually a little bit more like you in that way. And I've talked to others on this on this podcast about relationship building, and some people like to really establish a real friendly, you know, like even like you said, like that's invited to the birthday parties and everything else. And and I think that that's great if if you are comfortable with that perspective. But you know, again, it there's nothing wrong with having a a great working relationship with somebody without the expectation that you know that every time you come and see them that you're you're gonna play golf or go to dinner or whatever. It doesn't it doesn't mean you're not grabbing lunch once in a while with somebody, but it doesn't mean it's an expectation, right?

SPEAKER_00 16:11

Right. I kind of look at it as I always thought it was cool back in the day, like you would when you'd hear someone say, Oh, I have a person for that, I got a guy for that.

SPEAKER_01 16:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:19

Um for all those random things. I would just rather be the random guy for that.

SPEAKER_01 16:23

Be the guy for that, yeah. Yeah, no, no, I I I don't think there's anything wrong with that. And and again, everybody comes in with little different personalities and and characteristics like that. Uh certainly very, very good. Um what do you think it takes to be successful in this business? I mean, you obviously come from an operation side, you've seen um uh business outside of Lonnie, but but in your years here so far, what do you think is what does it take to be successful as an equipment distributor?

SPEAKER_00 16:57

Uh well, you really have to know your stuff at this point. Uh and really just having establishing a good set of fundamentals. Like one thing I think is so important is look, can you read model number and serial numbers? Um to me that's a very important, just basic skill to have, because let's say you know you're walking into a facility, like a laundromat, right? They have existing equipment, and you're it maybe you're thinking about, oh, maybe we should talk about selling them new equipment. Well, if if you go and age that equipment and it's less than probably 10 years old, the last thing you should really be doing is talking, is telling them, hey, you need to replace all this. Um so instead of just going that route, you look, hey, you know, I noticed you have this equipment, how's that working for you? Um where do you need help with parts on anything? Oh, I've noticed a couple of these. Maybe you're you have some out-of-order machines. Is there something I can help you with? What are you running into with this? And really just not going in and trying to ram metal down their throat every time you see them. It's really just, hey, I'm here to help you. And really just having that helpful, approachable stance on things, I found makes a huge difference. And and people are more comfortable talking to someone that they feel they can actually ask those questions to rather than just waiting for them to tell you you need to buy something.

SPEAKER_01 18:15

Yeah, I like that a lot. And and what I what I'm reading from that too is you know, you you've you realize that you can easily get the serial number off of any machine, and you all know where the number, where the number plates are, and if you can get into understanding how to dice dis you know decipher the dates, the manufacturing dates, they're all buried in that number at some point, depending on the brand, is that you come with a bit of understanding of that customer's uh business without even having to ask, oh, so when did you buy this equipment? They may not even be the ones who bought the equipment, they could have acquired the store and not even know how old the equipment is themselves. And so knowing that and knowing that they may not necessarily need new equipment yet, maybe it's only 10 years old, puts you in a much better position to have a conversation about other things that may be helpful to them. And that's gonna go a long way, I think, with your um how you're perceived by that store owner and so forth. That's a that's a really good take. Uh that's great.

SPEAKER_00 19:11

Yeah, and one thing with that too is you know, it every brand out there, no matter what, at one point has made really, really good equipment. You know, we all any brand has you know equipment out in the field that they can point to and say, look, here's a great example of the longevity of our equipment. Everyone has it, and when you see that in stores, even if it's not a brand that maybe you supply or distribute, you know, use that opportunity. Oh man, you have these in your store. Hey, you know what? Those are a great machine. Those are run them into the ground. And when you get to that point, or maybe when the parts are starting to get tough, let's have a conversation. But now, hey, you bought something great, just use it. That's what it's for. Make as much money as you can off that equipment before it dies.

SPEAKER_01 19:54

Yeah, and I think what you're what you're also you do is you're really building some trust in the fact that um you know you're you're not only there to move iron, like you said, just shove the steel down their throats and that. And if they realize that, then they will call you for other things because they may be looking to build another store or buy another location that needs to be equipped, and if they feel like this guy, because what what I keep hearing there in the back of my mind is some of the best salespeople in this industry were or are service techs. They're the people that repair the equipment, and there's a sense of trust along with your mechanic. Like if you were to go, even if you're buying a new car, you might ask your mechanic, what's what kind of car should I be looking at? You know, or um, and so people trust the guys that work on machines that understand that there's some life there, and that's what it gives reminiscent to me of that being um um one of those trust factors that comes along with that. So very good. Excellent, excellent. Yeah, absolutely. Um I want to talk a little bit about I'm curious to learn a little bit more about your your your regions. Is there anything that you would say because you you you're you're covering a region that I think for a long enough time to understand if there's something unique. I always feel like when I talk to different distributors, like, oh well, this is something I deal with here that you know is maybe unique about my our our area. You know, I was talking to a distributor um a few months back and talking about how there's just nowhere else, you can't build stores anymore. There's just nowhere to put them, it's just too dense, and so there's a lot of retooling of stores rather than doing something new. I'm curious what your what is unique about the the region that you carry, you cover?

SPEAKER_00 21:37

Yeah, well, you know, when you're talking about density and running out of space, right? It's almost it's a di almost a different thing here where you know when when you're looking at doing a new store, you're running your demographics and you're looking at like your three, five mile radius. Well, we'll have stores where people will drive 10, 15, sometimes 20 to 30 miles. A much bigger ring, yeah. Right. Right. You know, a the a big thing in the Midwest is going into town. And if someone is living out in a rural area, they're going into town for the day. Part of that is probably going to that laundromat. And so making sure, and they will drive past the bad laundromat that's 10 miles away to go to the one that's 20 miles away because they know it's it's it's open, the machines are ready to go, and it's just a more comfortable experience. We see that all the time in this area.

SPEAKER_01 22:28

Yeah, I mean I met something actually my father used to instill in my brother and I as we were growing up in this is idea is that if you're built if you're working a store in an area where people have to drive to, and there's of course there are inner there's city stores where people walk, and you know, those are that's a whole thing of itself. But as soon as someone has to get in the car, they will they can drive anywhere at that point. You know, once they're already in the car, to go past a nasty store, to get to a decent or a great store, is really not that much effort for that for that buyer. And so you can really think along those lines here, and you're you're you're you're explaining that perfectly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:02

Yeah, someone will drive further and pay more to use a store that they like better.

SPEAKER_01 23:10

Yeah. I I think I think that's something we have to continue to remember here uh in those areas where we have to drive. Um what about what about the any other challenges that you see in um in your regions? Is there anything unique to construction or uh utilities that are differ that you might that are that cause you challenges finding finding good space? I'm curious, is there anything unique about in those areas?

SPEAKER_00 23:37

Well, I can tell you we opened a store this year that runs on well water and propane. Oh wow. Okay. So yes, there are we don't I mean that's not super common, but yeah, you know, there's a lot of things that I think get taken for granted in more densely populated areas that we just don't have. But on the flip side of that, yes, I mean, finding finding space is still difficult. It absolutely is, and even still, we'll find landlords that may have a great building, but they just don't want a laundromat in it for their own reasons. But on the flip side of that is a lot of our customers in these regions, they tend to be contractors or are friends with contractors and are really more open to the idea of doing more of a build-out, um, which I find fascinating, and really it it helps quite a bit for us because we don't have to worry so much about the real estate portion of it. Um, a lot of those customers do that, but still, it's still finding space, finding a good location with good parking, or finding a lot that will work. Um, those challenges are still there. Uh some they're just really a lot more spread out.

SPEAKER_01 24:46

Yeah. Interesting. And um, yeah, I think that's the other thing that I I heard there too, is it seems like you're finding that these investors are maybe contractors of some way or they're connected to a contractor, which is really interesting because I feel like this is one of those um areas, this is one of those businesses that you can really do well in if you have a little bit of mechanical aptitude, even if it's not to repair the machines, but just understanding all the mechanicals kind of needed to put a project together that can be really valuable. Almost an opportunity to look for investors that are maybe in that way. Think about that a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 25:24

Yeah, absolutely. And really kind of what you touched on there, having some of that mechanical aptitude and a service mindset when you're talking to those folks is huge because a lot of times, too, after that store is open, when they run into issues, it's not as simple just to have a technician head that way, or there's a cost associated with that. But being able to explain to them, hey, here's the basic error codes that you might see, or if this pops up on your machine, this is what it means, this is what it's doing. Before we do schedule to have someone come out, check these three things first. Um do that with washers, dryers, any of your stuff because it it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when you will require some sort of service, and we're happy to teach you. We'd much rather teach some of our folks that are further away, empower them to make to be able to work on their stuff, and then when you do need a part, we're happy to get it to you, or if you need service, hey, we're happy to have someone come out.

SPEAKER_01 26:20

Yeah, no, that's that's that's valuable, particularly when you're servicing such a large you know territory. You you it's hard to get your service team to build drive to all these places in a in the time frame that they likely. So if you can find investors that have some mechanical aptitude or willing to take on a little bit of that research, you're gonna find a lot more success there. That's awesome. That's that's good. Yeah. Yeah. I would love to talk a little bit about. We we mentioned it just briefly before we started, too, is this you know, one of the big topics right now in our industry is just consolidation in general, just the idea that there's store owners that are, you know, stores are being bought by some private equity. I don't know if you've bumped into any of that yet, but certainly distribution seems to be going through somewhat of a consolidation phase. We've got independent groups that are buying up distribution with manufacturers that are either buying or opening distribution in different areas, and there's lots of reasons um why that I think that is happening. And I've talked about that on this on this podcast before. There's succession issues with a lot of family-owned businesses that have made it difficult for these uh operators to find a way to retire sometimes. I think there's been a lot of that, but I'm curious what are you are you is it how is it how do you how do you view this consolidation? And then I don't care if you maybe you talk about whether you've seen it on the store side. I don't know if you're seeing any of the PE firms come in and buy some build stores, or how are you seeing distribution, the consolidation distribution affect you in any way? Any any observations there?

SPEAKER_00 27:51

Well, I think one thing that we need to remember too is a lot of this consolidation is just a result of growth in our industry, and it's also not necessarily unique to our industry. Um, you see a lot of that consolidation happening right now in HVAC companies, it's happening, plumbing companies it's happening, even on real estate. So people have are starting to realize and kind of have gotten over the stigma of what a laundromat, what they thought a laundromat was, and see the potential in it. So, but I mean it is frustrating when you when you do run into some of those scenarios, but the way I look at that is more than ever, you have to have your head in the game. You you have to that's where you really have to figure out okay, what are we good at um can and and focus on that conversations do come up when you do have competition like that, you're able to resist. Sure.

SPEAKER_01 28:42

Yeah, you know, I was interested. We were interviewing uh recently uh um changing our accounting firms, you know, like looking for a new accounting to handle our our our accounting needs, and we're explaining how our businesses work and teaching and kind of explaining the distribution model and everything around that. And he was actually a little taken back. Oh, you guys still have independent distributors? Like he's worked in in other industries, like you said, that have gone through this consolidation and having this kind of more uh what's happening to us now, he's already seen it happen in some of the other uh small business work that he's done in years past. So he he was not surprised at all that this is happening to us. And the idea of laundry business not necessarily being as sexy as maybe some of these others out there is maybe changing a little bit. The perception you talked about is it's you know it can actually be pretty interesting. But um, yeah, I think I'm I'm observing the same things.

SPEAKER_00 29:33

Yeah, and you know, and the other part of that too, and you you touched on this a little bit, is there's almost like this perfect storm right now of where you do have a lot of people that have been in this industry for so long and are looking for that exit strategy, but maybe didn't haven't really ever they're almost forced to start thinking about it earlier than they wanted to. Sure. And suddenly it's like, I don't know what to do, I'm not sure who could take this over, and then suddenly someone's dangling a pretty large package in front of me. That's pretty attractive.

SPEAKER_01 30:00

Yeah, and I think one of the things I'd love to get your thoughts on this too is that so when we think about, you know, there's these groups that have large network of distributors that they've acquired over time. Tell me, do you feel like you're at any disadvantage selling against a distributor like that? Being in, you know, you guys are sizable too, but you're not one of these huge conglomerates either. So do you feel at any disadvantage?

SPEAKER_00 30:24

Um, there's definitely a disadvantage in terms of, I mean, the companies like that size are just so much better structured. You know, they're they're really, really good on probably that that initial process side, but really our advantage on that is the implementation side. Um, and yeah, you're going to have companies that are kind of come in and really, really bring in very low pricing and promise a lot of things. But I always look at that as if you're if that's the only strength that company has, um it it's it's it shows itself down the road. So, but we also still have to make sure that we are showing the best thing we can so to keep those things at bay.

SPEAKER_01 31:08

Yeah. Yeah, and I guess part of where I was going with this too is this idea is that I think, yeah, there's certain resources that maybe some of those organizations might have just because of their size. But in truth, when it comes down to working with a store an investor or store owner on it, I I still think that regardless if you're competing or not, you you are at not at a huge disadvantage. You actually can compete fairly well. Yeah, pricing is an important layer to this, but I feel like if you that's the direction that you go at and that's the way you sell, you actually are kind of selling yourself out of a job because if there's not gonna be any follow-up to it, there's not gonna be any help after the fact. They don't really need the the distributor. You know what I mean? And and I I'll argue as we started this that eliminating the distributor from this equation is not um is not gonna work. We're gonna have a lot of very upset store owners that have machines out of service that are not done correctly, that are not manageable, and gonna feel very under um uh taken care of. I don't know though, I'm trying to find the right word for it, but they're not they're not gonna be able to do that. You know, this is a big investment to get in this business. And if you can't deliver some kind of relationship, whether it's professional, personal, you know, whatever, uh you're gonna have a hard time being successful here.

SPEAKER_00 32:28

Absolutely. And I really think one of the part of that too is really that after sales support is so important. Um, and being that resource, you know, like having your own tech support, having the ability to provide those things quickly as well. Um one of the things I run into when we do get into those competitive situations is okay, what happens when the equipment leaves the dock? Yeah. Um, and a lot of times you'll you'll have competitors where that's where they kind of wipe their hands clean, hey, move on, hey, that's operations problem now. Where for us, even as a salesperson, okay, yes, we have the agreement. Now your job really starts. And that's where you can really show your value against someone of that size. It's like, hey, this is what we do, here's our examples of how we do it, and here's what to expect from us. And then, but you have to follow through on that too. That's the responsibility, is you have to actually do it. Yeah, and I think that's the part where people are starting to get a little they don't want to do it anymore.

SPEAKER_01 33:25

Yeah, you know, I it you just reminded me of something I saw fairly recently on social media, and we're all just kind of paying attention and observing our industry through the eyes of various people on social media, and then I'm seeing more and more content, you know, uh in our in our space. Uh, and I'm delivering it myself too, so I'm certainly one of the contributors. But one of the things I saw recently is a distributor that I've I've worked with for 20 or over 20 years, and I have a lot of respect for them. They do a great job. And I was watching a video that they had um actually not that they had posted, but the store owner had posted about being excited about a new delivery of laundry equipment. They're having the whole stores being retooled, and they're so they're showing videos of the trucks being unloaded. You know, there's a lot of moving parts, and they're moving all this off the semis or coming off and the and the equipment's being unloaded. And I can see the owner of the distributor there, and he's making sure that that equipment is getting in that building right. He's not the salesperson on that deal. He's he wants to make sure that this package is being delivered correctly, that it's all being done right, because there's a lot of, like you said, there's a lot of moving parts, and that's part of not just saying, well, once it leaves my dock, you got to work with this other group to get it done. This is following it all the way through. The salesman was there, the owner, the distributor was there, making sure this delivery was going well. They knew it was a big investment for the store owner, and they were all on hands on deck to be available for whatever comes up. And that's that's a big part of that. Not just the after-sales start, after sales layer doesn't isn't just after it's installed, it's the moment this the order is signed. You know what I mean? And then you know what goes on with it. So there's um there's a lot to be learned there.

SPEAKER_00 35:06

Absolutely. And to along that line, too, like with a new store, no matter what, no matter how well the install went or the equipment, those first six to eight months, you're going to have some growing pains. Sure. Um, and it's just inevitable. And I look at that as your job as a distributor is to help provide some comfort in those times. Yeah. You know, the first time a machine gets an error code or something goes wrong, the natural reaction from that owner is like, oh no, what do we do? Yeah, I just spent all this money and now my stuff's broken. This isn't good. And then so they reach out, but hey, Mr. and Mrs. Customer, I totally understand, no problem. Here's what's actually going on. Uh here's what your machine's doing, here's what here's what we'll do to help you. And depending on where you're at, usually we just come out the next day and like, hey, let's let's talk about this, let's work through, and then let's show you what to look for, you know, in the next day.

SPEAKER_01 35:55

There's your training opportunity, like you said. You've got opportunities to say, hey, you might see this once in a while, and here's where you can, you know, look deeper into the issue. Those are all great. Yeah, you know, it's um I we probably all need to make sure we do the right thing by customers, and I'm I'm certainly guilty of this as setting the right expectations uh for people who buy products to make sure it says, you know, this is you're gonna have an issue. I mean, I I I mean, we make great equipment, you sell great equipment, but everything is gonna have a problem at some point. It's natural, it's just the it's just it's the way life works, you know. So be prepared for that, set the right expectations up front so that when they get an error code on something, they're not freaked out or they're not worried about it, or they feel like they've made some big investment or big problem with this investment. Um that that's that's that's good, uh, that's great. Um, you know, I'm we're a technology company, you know that. You know, we we we uh we're we've been doing this a long time. I'd love to have a little discussion about where you think technology how technology is changing. You've been you've been doing this long enough, you know, 10 years, there's been a lot that's happened, just just the technology that's available on the laundry equipment, obviously, payment systems, everything else, point of sale. Tell me how you feel like the role as a distributor has changed with all of these technology options that are now available.

SPEAKER_00 37:11

Yeah, well, it's funny because yeah, I've been in this for 10 years, and I always used to say our sometimes our industry feels about 10 years behind the other ones when it comes to technology. I mean, the one of the things I always think about is the ability of remote monitoring your equipment. And you know, when that first started coming out when I was first getting into this industry, it was tough. And it was it was complicated, and I I think it kind of put a it it didn't go well, but we're seeing that get better. And I could say the same thing about payment systems, where early on some of those first true credit card readers they just sometimes they felt more complicated than they needed to be, but yeah, that wasn't necessarily the manufacturer's fault, it was just we just weren't there yet.

SPEAKER_01 37:53

Yeah. Um yeah, I think one of the things I'm hearing there too, and I'm curious if you felt the same way. We struggled sometimes with with you know promoting our product because it it I think the distributors felt that it was getting in the way of their they don't want to be disturbed by this complication. Did you ever feel that way?

SPEAKER_00 38:15

Yeah, absolutely, and it is kind of tough because um you know payment systems are obviously very, very important, but I mean I've had I've heard other sales reps on the vended side almost describe them as a you know a necessary evil. Yeah, and I can understand that, but really that's where these things are going. So, and they they continue just to get better and more simple to install. I still think there's a lot of opportunity to make that simpler and maybe more integrated. But from where we were in like 2017 to now, I mean you have a customer has so many options now. Um it does get tough though on the distributor side because you know we work with multiple payment system companies, and everyone does everything a little bit differently, and really the support is the support side is really paramount. Um some are better than others, um but really that that customer doesn't care that um this company's like this or that company's like that, they care that their store is down and that's your problem no matter what. So it's up it's on us to figure that out.

SPEAKER_01 39:25

Right. Yeah, and I think again, um you know, you say it's like a necessary evil, and maybe as we all get a little more comfortable with it, you know, we are we are behind on the technology side, and I think all of us that contribute to the different technology options that are available are trying to push us a little bit closer to to current. But there's actually there's a little bit of a comfort being behind too, because you know, it is not necessarily always the best place to be as on the cutting edge of certain things because we don't know how that's gonna play out in business. So being a little bit behind in our industry is actually, I have found to do a couple things. One is it allows us to manage um expectations because we can draw parallels to other things that have proven success on a certain technology front. Um, and then sometimes there's even a benefit from the pricing perspective, because if you're right at the very you know, the the brand new iPhone that comes out is always the most expensive one, but you could buy one that's three or four years dated or whatever, you know, model-wise, and save a lot of money that does 90% of the functionality of the new one, right?

SPEAKER_00 40:27

Right. Well, I do think one of the great things that we're seeing now with technology coming in is really for store owners, there's so many more options for them to help market their stores and build store loyalty. And because it used to be really if you had a laundromat, just by existing, you would get a fair amount of business. But now you really have to have something that sets you apart. And everyone's asking, how do we reach more people? How do we get people in our store? And really, most of your payment systems, you have the ability to reach those people through that. If it's just through an app, through a loyalty program, and really to some of the marketing companies too now that focused on laundry. I mean, right.

SPEAKER_02 41:06

I still think that's yeah, yeah, that's insane.

SPEAKER_00 41:09

I love the fact that and for us as a distributor, we can point our customers to those resources. Look, hey, look, I'm really good at the washers and dryers and your back end stuff, but if you want to learn how to market your store, here's a couple options. Reach out to these folks, they're great at what they do. Please talk to them instead of me.

SPEAKER_01 41:26

Yeah, no, you're you're you're spot on, and it's it is actually maybe validating to our industry of the fact that we're attracting marketing companies that want to do something focused on that. And um, and and I've always you've you've basically gave my sales pitch, I've always considered the payment system to not just be the collection piece of the money, which is obviously you know a barrier to entry. You gotta take payment, you know, that you gotta do that. But for me, the exciting part has always been is leveraging it as a tool to stand out. And I think one of the terms that's often used nowadays with social media is you need to find a way to draw attention to you, right? Word of mouth is great and it will always be a big factor, I think, in laundries. You know, people tell with you know, oh, this laundromat's great, and then you're gonna you're gonna draw a business out, but it's gonna be kind of slow and organic, and it's gonna kind of happen that way. If you want eyes on you now, you need to stand out in some way. You know, you need to have something different, whether it's a promo that you can do through your payment system or whatever technology, use the technology as a way to stand out and to be unique and different. So I'm glad you recognize that as well. Yeah. I think we we need as distributors need to keep reminding store owners you have this massive toolbox of things that you will you need to leverage in some way. You whether you know you do it or you hire a marketing company to help promote the things that you're doing, you can do a promo in your store, but if nobody knows that you're doing it, you know, it's kind of like you're just giving it to the customers who are to do business with you.

SPEAKER_00 42:58

Yeah, and I think that kind of ties back to you know what what makes a good distributor great is recognizing those resources and not really gatekeeping them, because you know, hey, look, if you are looking for X or Y, look, hey, I may not be the best person to talk to about it, but here's a couple people you should talk to. Um reach out to them, let them know I called you, and that then you just then that person's happy, the customer's happy, and your network continues to be happy.

SPEAKER_01 43:24

Yeah, yeah, that's great. That's good stuff. Um, as we as we start to kind of wind things down, I'd like to ask, you know, I'd like you to ask me 10 years in, let's say um you're faced with a brand, a new brand new distributor salesman, you've been you you want to give them some advice on like how do you be successful? What is the first thing that you at you you start to guide a new person getting in this business to really start? Because it's hard when you're new, yeah. I mean, think about everything you've learned over the 10 years, and you can't expect a guy that's just started uh to Learn all of that. Where do you start them? What's the path to help them start to find some success here?

SPEAKER_00 44:06

Yeah, well, and I think to kind of what you just said there is start small. Um, you know, we have this tendency to complicate things pretty quickly. So if you're new to this business, at a minimum, if especially on the Venn side, go out to laundromats, spend some time in them, just look at them, and then um do laundry. Um it's a you know, sometimes you can kind of tell uh someone's talking about a laundromat and they've never spent any time in one. Um that's really important, and also it it's okay to uh to fail on things. Um I kind of have an expression if you're gonna fail, fail in flames, because that means that you tried. And uh so and if you really don't know what to do, and you have folks that are doing installs with your company, go with them and be willing to hold the flashlight and get yelled at. Yeah, um you learn so much just from observing those things, and it will take time, but the more you can really just have a basic understanding of again equipment age, what it takes, and really the life cycle of what people should expect, that is gonna serve you so much better than you know being really just really really out there and just using your personality. Now, don't get me wrong, personality is important. All helps, yeah. Yeah, but really just figuring out what your process and the way to talk to folks that really just feels more conversational, right? And really learn to be quiet.

SPEAKER_01 45:37

Be a good listener. I mean, that's sales 101, right? Be a better listener than you are a speaker, yeah. Yeah, and I think you also touched on this idea that you know getting getting immersed into it, whether it's doing laundry. I mean, I I have so many employees, and um, you know, maybe my business on the card side is a little bit unique, but that have really almost never used a laundromat before. And actually, one of the things that we do for our support training now is that when you get hired onto our support team, you know, basically to answer the phone and help people over the phone with the support, one of their training exercises is to go to a store with a laundromat with one of our systems in it and do laundry there. We'll pay for it, we'll do your our laundry's on ours, but you must go to a laundry and do laundry using one of our systems, and we obviously find one that's near their home and and we get them connected in there because we've got people all over the country now. And um, that's an eye-opener for people because they're like, I haven't done laundry in a laundromat since college or you know, or ever, maybe. Maybe I've never been in a laundromat before. Maybe their mother's been doing their laundry their whole lives. Who knows? It's a it's an eye-opener. That's phenomenal training. Yeah, yeah. It's been really it's been really eye-opening, and I think it's you know, I think it's easy, it's an easy thing for anybody to do. But what you said, which I think is even better for a distributor who's getting into this, is go to the install, hold the flashlight, push the machine with the with the with the with the guy that's rigging it, uh, put you know, wear jeans and a t-shirt and help them in any way you can. You know what I mean? Whatever you're capable of, be there. Because when you talk about learning about the facilities and that whole how valuable that is, how better to do that when you actually see the anchors being drilled into the floor, the extra concrete that maybe had to be poured, the electric electrical work, and it just all seeps in every time you watch it a little bit more and see the challenges that go into that. Um yeah, that's that's actually great advice, really good advice.

SPEAKER_00 47:33

Yeah. And it really is just you have to be open and understanding that you don't know that much and that's okay. But the only way to gain the knowledge is really to immerse yourself in it. Yeah. Um, I mean, and even if that is, hey, you're just you're just sweeping the floor and pulling the trash out, but you're at least there and you get to see that process from start to finish and realize that really an installation can be a bit of a character building exercise.

SPEAKER_01 47:59

Yeah, yeah. Even even one of our one of my salespeople, uh one of our territory managers, was telling me this morning that she went to an install. She's seen, she's been in lots of stores with our products in, but never actually witnessed um a card system get installed. And she's like, I didn't realize how much how much work it is to do it. I mean, and again, she doesn't have a good frame of reference, it's the same amount of work as any system, but she didn't realize what the what the energy that goes into putting these things in. The distributor has a lot to do. They might have to do a little framing to get the kiosk installed. There might be holes to drill in the machines, there's you know, all of these things that they have to be in, and it was an eye-opener. I think it just gives you a frame of reference, and so that could be translated from a distributor, from a customer perspective. Observe, be a good, be a good listener, and then keep your mouth quiet a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 48:50

Yeah, well, and absolutely, and and to your point on frame of reference, so when you're a salesperson and you're quoting, let's say, the installation portion of that process, you know, that gives you a lot more justification and really logical reasoning behind what it costs because you do know what it actually takes to get it done. And it's not going to be the same across the board. Um you know, being able to walk a site and understand what it would take to convert that place is so important.

SPEAKER_01 49:20

Yeah. Yeah, that's great. Well, you know, I think that um you've shared a lot here today, Kevin. I really appreciate you joining me. This is uh, you know, it's it's great to get to know you a little bit, and I know that we will uh our cross our paths will cross here soon, and we I really appreciate you you know being willing to kind of share your experience and your time with us. It's been great to speak to you, and I appreciate you joining me.

SPEAKER_00 49:43

Yeah, thanks for having me, Steve. This has been great. All right, awesome. Thanks, Kevin. Take care of it.