SPEAKER_01 0:14

Welcome to CCI Drivetime, the podcast for vended laundry distributors. I'm Steve with CCI, using your drive time to cover laundromat trends, payment systems, and practical topics you can use in the field. Today's episode, I had the pleasure to talk to Jason Fleck, who is the senior vice president of strategic partnerships over at Laundrolux, one of the major manufacturing lines in this industry. And I've known Jason for many years, and he is just a wealth of information, um, has seen a lot, um, has seen what works, what doesn't work, and we had just a great industry conversation, and I think you will enjoy it. So here we go, Jason Fleck. Jason, great to see you. How are you doing today?

SPEAKER_00 1:04

Wonderful, Steve. Thanks for having me on the podcast. Great to be here.

SPEAKER_01 1:08

Yeah, uh, I appreciate you taking time out of a very busy uh schedule that I know you have. Um uh we just participated in an event that you guys hosted uh this past week in St. Louis, and it was a great success from all indicators uh of our team and the on the and the things that I saw, certainly on social media. So um, you know, before we jumped on, we talked a little bit about it. But um, you know, I let's start because I can't imagine there's anybody out there that doesn't know who you are for as long as uh you and I have been doing this. But I likewise. Yeah, well, I appreciate that. But I I think I think more so it would be really important. Um just give us your the 30 seconds of like kind of tell us who you are, what you do for your organization, and you know, if you have if you can remember, how did you get into this?

SPEAKER_00 2:00

Yeah, that's a great question. Uh you know, like anything, it it was a slow evolution of of things, but it started off um as a factory rep for uh a brand that when I got started in the business was was very little known. And and was a big part of like helping that brand become uh more of a household name in the industry, and and uh and put a lot of years in there, and then uh came to Laundrelux in 2020 um uh for a big opportunity to do something, and there was somewhat of a glass ceiling at my former employer for there. And and I think it was uh interesting because you you wear a lot more hats, smaller organization, but also a really uh more a distributor uh in the sense of of than a manufacturer, and so so a lot more in common with probably laundry concepts than than than my former employer. So it was it was very interesting. Um and the strategy was was exciting and and it reminded me of the stuff I loved when the other brand was young, and and so I was like, well, we can we can um I know what to do with this, you know, and and so it was it was there was a lot of freedom given to me at Laundry Lux to do that, and one of the freedoms that was given to me really um in sometime in like 2025 was was to like write out what I wanted to do. And and I had just gone on the road a little bit to see what we were actually doing out there, and um I wasn't really I attended a bunch of shows and I and and like we were kind of saying, I was uh disappointed in in what I had seen. And I in in my mind I thought, well, I I know what this should look like. I know what I want to see when I come to these things, and and part of it is just years of going around the country, working with the biggest distributors, seeing the best of what they do, combining all those elements, and and as many as I can I can, you know, I I still would argue there there are some distributors that that just probably do it even better, but but I but I um putting that together into something and and bringing it to an audience that's somewhat underserved in some markets, and in some markets it's maybe a little more overserved and and and seeing what happens there. Uh that's been that's been the fun of the laundry summit as of late.

SPEAKER_01 4:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

You know?

SPEAKER_01 4:42

Yeah, you know, I you know, just uh to kind of circle back on that, I think what I have noticed is you guys have been continuing to be really persistent, and I'd say consistent is a better way, but you know, obviously you all have to be persistent in sales, but the consistency that you guys have put on is probably attributing to the popularity that I think you're starting to see in your attendance because I think you know as well as anybody how hard it is to get somebody to show up to an event like this, and you guys are really doing a great job. And I and I'd love to, you know, kind of pick your brain just for a second. Like, what does it take to get investors and store owners to show up to these events? What are you finding that it takes to get them to show up?

SPEAKER_00 5:28

Um I I think you you nailed it consistency. Um I had a I had a great distributor once tell me that we were I was going to one of the first shows he had ever done in a new market, and he was like, um, you just gotta keep doing it. You know, you just gotta be consistent. It's gonna start off small, and it's gonna start and and and stick with it. You don't give up right away. Um but but certainly the uh also I would say the the ads, the social media, the the the the ways you you get the word out is is very important, and and there's there's a lot of different methods to do that, and and I've tried them all. And I've spent you know money on things that didn't work and money that does work, and now I'm kind of dialing it in. But but I think uh that that's the key thing is just really um making the sales team do a little legwork too. Never hurts. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

Well, the consistency is really key to that because it allows you to try everything and then dial in what actually works so that you know there's there's really a method to this madness of the don't give up on on things uh just because it didn't work well maybe the first time. Um, and isn't that just sales 1012 at the end of the day? Is like don't stop. I mean, you know, you may you're not gonna win every deal, but you're gonna you're gonna learn from every opportunity, and then eventually turns into why can't that be translated into everything we do? You know, shows are something that I remember and again, our fathers, I've known you for a long time. Our fathers were in this business uh as well. Uh I think uh both retired now, but we learned a lot from them over the years. And I can remember um my dad talking about the shows that they would do in the 80s, okay. Um, and they would sell it, they would sell over a million dollars of equipment at a show. Like that would be regular one 1.5 million. It was, you know, it was it was like, and I'm like, I don't know what unless someone had a deal pre-written before they came to a show, that just wasn't gonna happen. You just don't see that happen. I think some of the expectations have changed for the events now. You know, we we're looking for we certainly would love to sell a million dollars worth of equipment. That that doesn't happen every event. Um, but I think what has happened, and you I'd love to hear your thoughts on this because you've seen the evolution of manufacturers and distributors and how things have changed over the years, is that the reason why they could sell so much equipment um was it was the only time you could get a special. That was the only a deal was only offered at this two-day event, and that was when everybody kind of did the buy-in that said, all right, we're all gonna put our best foot forward. So if you were thinking about buying equipment, this was the day to do it. And it's really hard nowadays because my understanding, and you tell me if you agree, is that you can find a pretty good deal almost every day of the week now, if you really ask for it, if you're a good negotiator. So getting people to come to these things is uh been, I think, a real challenge, which is why you know hats off to you guys for the attendance you've had. So, you know, what do you think about that? The the shows of of the discounts, and now they're they're really it's a little differently positioned now.

SPEAKER_00 8:47

I I think I look back to like what I was doing. Your dad's story is great because it reminds me a little bit of the first time I ever had a distributor tell me that we were gonna sell a store at a at an investment seminar. And we were in Mobile, Alabama, and he took out an ad, a black and white text ad in a Sunday business section of the paper. This is how old this is, like 2002 or three. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I went to the investment seminar with him, and we had rented this little hotel room, and we spent like 1,500 bucks. It felt like the end of the world in terms of like how much we had spent, you know, because it was like that was a lot of money for a show, but and and here's the best part four people show up. Four people show up. He does his investment seminar, and he sells the laundromat to uh one of the one of the couples of the of the four people. And I thought, man, I I was so blown away. And I begged him for a copy of his investment seminar. He finally he like he's like, no, I can't give it away. It's secret sauce. But he finally gave it to me. And I actually looked at it the other day and I was like, you know what's funny is some of the some of the information's still practically useful. It's just it's it's weird how little the business really has changed, as much as it has changed. There's some things that just have not changed. And and um I was I you know, other than it the fonts and the graphics looking very dated now, it was it was still very good information. And I thought, and it worked clearly on a very small audience. So I you know, I I think about the evolution of the show, and and you know, you you the numbers are great to have, but but you really just need quality, you know. I would have quality over quantity and if I could choose. But um, I also I also really want to not just do the old like you when you're going out to distributors and you have it in a warehouse, and um there's the there's a six-pack of beer on top of a washer, and it's like, what do you guys want to learn today? You know, and and it's and and that's the old way of doing things. And we're gonna do a service school and it's gonna be cold or hot, depending on where you're at, you know. And we're gonna open the door and try to and everybody's in lawn chairs, and and I thought to myself, you know, that I grew up doing that for years and years and years. That's all I did. And and I think um I you know, it's got it it I look at ads today, and people are really focused on selling boxes, yeah, and um they forget that we're selling laundromats, we're not selling boxes. So I I think the strategy is really just to to to earn trust by talking about you know um laundromats as a whole and and all the ecosystem that's in it is is all part of it, you know, and and uh give it's it's kind of like you hear great operators say, I'd like to give my customers choices uh for payment. Um I if they want to use cash, they can use cash. If they want to use, you know, car, they can use car. I I you know sometimes I agree, sometimes I want to take cash completely out, but but at the end of the day, I get what they're saying. And I think I think shows are kind of also that way is is like because you'll have you'll have people walk in who are very um fond of this combination of items in their stores, and and it's not really my I'm not gonna talk them out of that unless unless it's it's detrimental to you know you know the their business, which which in most cases it's not. So so I you know I try to be as agnostic as I can in those choices and present all the options that are popular and and really um be a resource and and in and bring people with me. I I don't want to do it alone, I can't do it alone. Um I I look at how many people we've had at the summits and it's it's like in the 50s now of speakers on all kinds of different things, and that makes me excited because it was never supposed to just be in my mind, I I wanted to open the doors up a little bit and and not just be laundrelux, you know, which is is um probably uh scary but you know to do because you don't ever know what you're really gonna get. But but it's been wonderful so far. It's been it's been wonderful. Um the and the the response we've gotten from the attendees is that um they weren't sure what to what to think and then they showed up and they were you know blown away. But for me, it's just like um how do I deliver on all these topics that are um you know pain points for distributors. I mean for for store owners, sorry.

SPEAKER_01 13:48

Sure, sure. Well, I find it, you know, you've said a lot there, and I think where no, no, it's good. I mean, I it's it's it's all good stuff. I think where what I think has been really great, and it's been it's really a shift, you know, coming from a manufacturing perspective, you know, from CCI's perspective, is the number of events that you guys are hosting. And really, I think you're leading to some degree because we're seeing events all over the place and in an increased pace. So, you know, I guess, you know, what do they say is like uh, you know, imitation as a form of flattery. I mean, you're seeing events just kind of really escalate significantly. And so, you know, companies like us and the others that you go so gracefully, gracefully include us in these in these shows has been a real interesting dynamic for us to get out there more and in a setting like that where everybody is out in this open floor and you're able to really um, I want to say the word compete, but they get to compare and you get to do it in real time rather than have a conversation and then maybe on an email and then they email you and then email the other guy. They can just walk around the room and have a conversation about the things they like. And I would imagine that, you know, I've seen you know the layouts of these events, and you've got some equipment there. You want people to look at your laundry equipment. Of course, that's that's what we're hoping for at some point in the deal, but you can only have so many people in front of that equipment at a time. So having somewhere else for them to go and kind of socialize and and interact with the other ancillary things, I think is really smart. So um, you know, again, kudos to you and great for for leading the effort that it comes uh you know into having these events. Um, it'll be interesting over the next few years uh to watch you guys continue to grow with it and see what the attendance looks like and just how how you discover what works and what doesn't and what makes a good show. But I think you guys are on the right path. I'd I'd love to I'd yeah, you absolutely deserved. I I'd love to talk a little bit more specifically about distribution. Um, you know, that's what I I started this podcast to try to help promote uh good distribution. And I feel like I was mentioning earlier to you, like I almost feel like to some degree it's somewhat of a lost art a little bit, but yet it doesn't have to be. And I think that one of the reasons is there's not enough resources that distributors have to help them get new people on board. You know, you have your your legacy dealers out there, distributors that have been doing it for 20 plus years and they they know how to do it, but when they want to hire someone, it's tough, right? To get that new person up to speed and all of that. And so, you know, this is one of my this is my small contribution to get them introduced to all the key players, some of the ideas that go into it. But it's you know, but as you mentioned earlier, the things that we were doing 20 years ago that were very simple, those core tenants still exist today. And if you just if we just remind people what they are, I think we can help new people get into this business and be attracted to distribution and and to get hired on. So my question to you is you know, what do you consider to be a strong distributor? What what are the attributes of what makes a strong distributor for launder locks?

SPEAKER_00 17:03

Um that's that's a great question. I I I really I look at it from you know, what what are they doing to generate activity in the market? And I find that the distributors that stir up the most activity in the market tend to benefit. And so that's why, you know, earlier in my career I was big on blitzing because largely because um I'd say 75% of my distributors um weren't really going out and working the market, and you could tell when you sat down and talked to them.

SPEAKER_01 17:40

Yeah. And for blitzing, it's it's boots on the ground, is what you're saying. Literally get in your car, drive to every location, and just try to walk in, right? That's blitzing.

SPEAKER_00 17:49

Yeah, and it it was just like, hey, let's let's put an activity together. And and like I think back to like my history teacher in fifth grade, Mr. Hume, one of my favorite teachers, taught me that you know, George Washington was an amazing general because he'd get on his horse and ride it right in the front of the battle. And and I thought, that's what, that's what I should do as a as a I want to be I want to be on the street and I want to be knocking on doors with my distributor and really um and and I kind of kind of enjoyed that. It was it was part of you know, aside from all the the other work that we did, it was the most fun of the job. And and I found that um we learned a lot from that. We learned about um not just the people that liked us who are gonna show up at our shows, but the people who aren't in our camp, um, who might not show up at our shows. And I found that if we we went, we talked to them and had a conversation, even if it was slightly like uncomfortable, um, it it was it progressed into something that they might show up at our next show. So right. I I but I think that's what distributors have to do to be um to lead in their market is is and it's it it is kind of old school, but but it's it's very true. Um maybe some marketing also would help, you know. Um I I think about how far marketing's come with social media and things like that, and there's there's always room to improve there for for everybody, but um uh doing doing some testimonials of of people that you've helped in the business. Tremendous. There's a lot of bad information online uh about laundromats, and and that's another reason I I wanted to do the summit is I wanted to get real experts in the room and and try to give these people, you know, a resource that that was at least you know an industry resource that had uh real you know teeth in the in the in in the industry. And and I think when you go on TikTok and you hear, you know, I'm getting a laundromat for nothing, and you know, and some of these things that are going around and maybe that happens like a like once in a you know millions, like winning the lottery, yeah, yeah. But it's not really a great way to um and people get started off on the wrong foot that they don't need any money to get into a laundromat. That's not true. Um so you know, to to yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:24

No, I I just I you it's it's a again, you're giving me so much to work with. I forget, I don't want to forget it all before I get through it. It's like it's like you're taking you just you're a source of just uh of of great information. And what I'm hearing here is the the I mean the blitzing, the boots on the ground. I mean, to me, that you know, you know, if you want to use the the the really old school, it's almost like cold calling, right? But it doesn't have to be a negative thing. A lot of times when you talk to young people today, they don't want a cold call that you know, they don't want to do that. But you know what? But when you're when you're an expert and you show up with a with care and concern and you don't have to necessarily be selling every time you walk in the door, it could be just inviting them to an event, it could be just you know presenting information. It's really kind of the mentality goes in there, and that is we talk about new people. The first thing you should do if you join a distributor, and obviously you're gonna learn about your products, is get in the car and stop at every possible store, drop cards off, drop plant pamphlets off. Old school stuff still works. And you know, we talked about the numbers game, it is a numbers game. Sales has always been a numbers game. You know, you if you can stop on 150 stores, you know, if so what if you only get five people that you can talk to? So you know, so what? As you said, all you needed is one guy to buy a store and and that entire week's worth of work was completely worth it, you know. So you know, you just need the one opportunity on the in the right cadence and and and it's all paid for. So it's like baseball, right? Like seven innings of complete boredom. And then boom. The payoff. Yeah, that's right. Then you get you get to pay off. Yeah, it's so true. And I I I it's amazing how I think um we've get we've been separated from that a little bit in some markets, and they feel like it should just happen. Like they the they should just show up at your door and and want to build a laundromat or buy laundry equipment, and it's just it's not that. You need to you need to get out there, you need to hear what people are saying, you need to tell them what you know, you need to share what you heard from the guy down the road. I mean, you almost become somewhat of a rumor mill, but it it gives you a sense of authority in the market that you know what's happening in town, right? And so those blitzes that you guys are do you guys are doing is just a grassroots effort to get in front of people again, which I think I think has been lost in some in some uh in some markets for sure. Um yeah, no, uh really, really good stuff. So I guess I when I think of distribution, I also think about uh can being a consultant as much as a salesperson. And we you know we used to kind of touch on that a little bit too, and I wanted to circle back on it is you know, offering customers options and what they what what they should do to help them get off the ground, whether it's you know it's a new store or retool or whatever the case may be, is to be a consultant. And I wonder what your thoughts are on distribution, having access to many more products than they've ever had. You know, we got you have access to, I mean, I'll just talk about payment systems. There are more payment systems at these events than any other singular like industry that there is, and there's so many options out there, but that's true of all of the segments. What role, uh what role do you think the distributor should play acting as a consultant to help the customer make the right choice? Because you know, there's one thing where you just open up a catalog and say, here, just pick out of the book, you know, and then but I feel like we've done a little bit of a disservice, right?

SPEAKER_00 23:53

We do. I I am a big fan of um like I I think of like if you're on a blitz, for example, we since we're on that topic, I I have new salespeople that I'm training, and and they're like, Whoa, and and I'll follow them, and I'm like, you're talking this time. And then we run into a store owner and they choke. And they don't know what to say. I'm like, here's here's your five minutes. This guy's busy. Yeah, what are you gonna what are you gonna say? And and it's like you know, and I and I say, look, if if if you're uncomfortable, here's a here's a methodology I found that works. You start really high topic, like, what are you gonna do with this store? You gotta are you gonna are you gonna retool it? Are you gonna add technology to it? Are you gonna sell it? Or are you gonna build an another store? I mean, somebody's in the world. It's one of those things.

SPEAKER_01 24:44

Yeah, it's gonna be one of those things. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:47

And and it and then let them tell you, uh, you're not pushing yourself your products yet, and and it's just a great, it starts a conversation, and um, you know, and and a lot of times I I listen to sales guys, the worst thing they do is is they talk the whole time and they don't listen and they don't ask the right questions, you know. And so I think I think that that starts a consultative approach that works really well with store owners.

SPEAKER_01 25:16

Yeah, yeah, no, I agree. And the the talking is something that I think we all suffer from a little bit because it's somewhat of uh uh over talking, what I mean, you know, more listening, more talking. We hear that all the time when it comes to sales and it the new people way over talk, out of probably out of nerves more than anything else. It's like they feel like they have to keep going, but you need to take a breath and let them say something. You know, I um and then and then the idea that I've also is tied to that, but is this idea of letting um don't don't talk your way out of a deal too? Like it's like, hey, they're ready to buy, stop. Now you just stop, let them finish the deal, don't talk them out of it, you know. And it comes to this nervousness that comes along with it. And it's just it takes real discipline to stop and just let someone talk and take it all in, remember the key points, and then circle back to it. Yeah, it's that's uh that's that's awesome stuff. Um, let's what I want to talk just a little bit about what you're seeing. You know, you guys are have have made a huge impact in the markets that you're in. You guys have I've seen some beautiful stores with your equipment in them over the years, and certainly you know, you guys are excellent with the technology side, your controls are you know top-notch. Um, people obviously love the equipment. And I'm curious, maybe you could share a little bit what do you think is what what is working in stores right now? Like what is what are you seeing as being consistent in stores? Because that's what we want the distributors to lean on, is like this is working, and and and this is what you should be considering. Is it heavy controls? Is it layouts? Is it what what is what are you seeing as kind of some of the magic or there's lots of magic, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:01

You guys are great at what you what you do around around, you know, your two companies really. I've I've seen your distribution side there locally, and I've seen some of the stores you do are very premium and and beautiful, absolutely beautiful. Uh you should be very proud. You're great customers, great stores. You guys know how to lay out a store. I I always think to myself, like, future, you know, facing like what what what is this store gonna need down the road, you know, what what is gonna 15 years from now still be you know fairly leading edge? And and and I I I believe you know customer experience is is more important than it's ever been uh for laundromats. So, you know, the the old absentee model might still be out there, but as as we see kind of uh maybe some generational uh transitions of wealth and things that are going on, uh I I see a different kind of owner stepping into the scene and and they're they're more interested in a retail experience. And so I I try to I try to kind of I like those customers, they're they're fun to work with. Uh they're they're interested in in uh making their customers, it's every customer comes to the door, it's the worst day of the week, it's laundry day, and and and uh and a great operator taught me once that my job is just to make them more comfortable and that's and and have a good time. And and and and you're never gonna give them the greatest day of the week, but you're you could maybe make them a little bit happier. So I and then people will drive further and pay more money, and that's the kind of customer that you want, that I want, because they're also gonna consider some of your premium options that you want to sell, and you believe in them because if you build a store, you'd probably be putting those premium things in your store. Uh and and the worst thing is when somebody just cuts all the corners and goes in as as as cheap as possible and and you just yeah. I almost I almost would rather just hand those customers to someone else to deal with. But because it's it's kind of like, man, you know, at the end of the day, if if you if you treat your distributor, if you if you don't take his advice and you and you I mean if your distributor knows what he's talking about, he's he's and he's he's really um respected and has done, you know, you look at like his install base and there's a successful customers around, uh you should listen to him. You shouldn't, you know, I I don't want to say like uh I you shouldn't uh treat him badly, bend him over the rail. Be fair. Yes, be fair because at the end of the day, I think uh it's a it's a long-term relationship you're gonna be in with that distributor. And if if he feels beaten up and taken advantage of, he's probably gonna make some choices when you call on a Friday night and you need help. And and uh you know, I can't blame him. Uh but but but be fair to your distributor, it's a great relationship that you you'll have for a long time unless unless he messes up uh or she. And and so I think I think at the end of the day, like the when I when I think of the importance of a distributor relationship, it it still is very relationship oriented. Yeah. But um, but we we are seeing higher rents, higher labor, um, higher build-out costs, um, higher equipment costs, and costs are really getting higher, which is which is why uh store owners are really looking at other revenue sources where why wash dry fold has gotten so popular, um, that it has its own show now. I I you know you and I probably used to put a pro forma together, and sometimes we left wash dry fold out of the pro forma, you know. And we would just see does this cash flow without wash dry fold? Now, now you gotta put it in there somewhere. Yeah, you know, 10%, 30%, whatever, whatever the magic number is, um, because these costs have gotten so high. So so I I think um that's that's kind of what's changing out out there that I see.

SPEAKER_01 31:19

Yeah, you know, again, awesome stuff. And I think what I what I interpret you saying and what I've been preaching for a bit now is the cot, you're absolutely right. The costs are only going in one direction. We are not going to see costs, whether it be equipment, build out, all that, it's not gonna ever go down. It's only gonna go up. And so when you think about what the investment is to open up a new store, you know, I think you instead of saying, well, everything costs more, so I need to cheap out on as much as I can, instead, what you're seeing investors like, no, I need to lean in hard to make sure this is the best experience that a customer's gonna use so that I can feel confident that when I build this and I spend the millions of dollars that it's ultimately going to take me to do this right, that they're gonna come, you know, that they're gonna get the experience that they want, whether that includes the full service side of things, whether it just this the finishes that you decide to ultimately put in, the technology that you invest in to make sure you give them that experience. It's the it and that's those are the successful stores, I think is what we're what we're seeing here, not the the bare minimum. Like I'm gonna get you a store, you know, vanilla box, concrete floors, and uh, you know, the the most basic uh uh lighting that's possibly available in this market that is gonna look like garbage in nine months, you know, in nine months. Yeah, yes, basically leaning on things, yeah. That's right. It's all it's it's uh there's ways of doing it that way, but it won't look good uh very short amount of time. So um amazing stuff there. Um yeah, you know, I guess I'd love to tell I'm a technology company, we don't hide from that. I'm curious your thoughts on on the tech that you're seeing. Um, you know, obviously you guys have awesome controls. I mean, I know we're intimately familiar with your controls, the compass pro and the Claris Vibe and all that stuff. We're very familiar with it. Um tell me how if how what you guys think when it comes to tech and um and and how are you promoting it, how are you leveraging it to and your sale?

SPEAKER_00 33:24

I I I if you look you look back like 15, 20 years ago, you know, there were there were tactile buttons you would hit and the programming was really hard to do. You had to scroll through all these menus, you had to know all the gibberish of the screen to understand where you were at and how to go forward and back. I mean, that was like today it's it's so much easier. People have it easier, man. I mean, I a lot easier. And what and what in in some ways, I mean, simple was great, but but I think I think the I the ability to completely customize the control and trick out every cycle and every icon is is so so cool. Uh when when you really sit there and look at it and you think about how far we've gone. And and you can you can I had like a cut I had a a guy who built a store in kind of a higher end middle class area um in Texas, and he wanted a clean out cycle because his customers were were more, you know, they didn't know who had just used the machine and they were more picky about the sanitary side. And so, you know, and we were able to go in and create something that just rinses it out and for a little bit like a pre pre-rinse. And and you couldn't do that back in the old days, you know, you it would be really hard to do. Um, so it was it was you know, a lot of flexibility there on on cycles, on controls. The um I mean the Claris V machine is a great machine, it works with a um dosing system. It can actually tell, it can actually weigh the load, put the right amount of water in there. Uh so if somebody underloads the machine, like puts 30 pounds in an 80 pounder, it only put 30 pounds of water versus 80 pounds of water, you know, and and I'm not using the ratios correctly, but you get what I'm saying. But but the other cool thing is it can call for soap and only use the thirty the right 30-pound version of soap versus the 80, which is I think pretty pretty neat, you know. It's brilliant, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And I think about like a lot of machines are dumb, they don't they don't know what's really in there, and they just do their thing no matter what. They they drive for 36 minutes no matter what, or they they wash like like there's a full load in there. Yeah. And and when I think about like those differences are massive when compounded across the store, across the years that you would have that equipment, um, it's almost makes so much sense that I think everybody will have a version of it at some point, you know.

SPEAKER_01 36:01

Sure, like like Axel Airflow. Imitation is uh flattery again, so you guys will be watching out for that. But but you know what? Again, to just you know mirror what you said. The to me, the laundry business, when we talk about retail customers now that use laundromats, the machines they walk up. We we use jar that's a 20, that's a 30, that's a 50-pound machine, but our customers don't know what a 20-pound machine is. And so it's all about perception. Do I think my laundry will fit in that machine? And they miss, they get it wrong a lot, you know. And so why why would we want to have the machine run uh and not in an optimal way if they underload a machine? And we know it's much harder on a machine to underload it generally than it is to overload it. So, you know, putting 30 pounds in an eight-pound machine is is not generally a good idea. But as long as you're giving them the perception of the quality that they need, and it's giving you some, you know, helping the equipment be a little better, it's giving them the right kind of wash, not over soaping, you know. If you imagine all the soap that would the Turgent that would be in there, so all that's really good stuff. And you guys are have definitely been leading that the course there.

SPEAKER_00 37:05

Yeah. Um I I I love it. I I think about I think about like uh I used to go see this distributor in Memphis and he had a 7,000 square foot store, his little distributorship was in the back. And I come into the front door, and the first row was the 80 pounders, and he had them, I don't know, four-inch base or something. They were on a base. I know the manufacturer tells them not to do that, but you know, everybody does it. So I I come in and there's this uh little Hispanic guy there, and he's like, Hey, don't you have anything smaller than this 80 pounder in the store? And I'm like, Yeah, it's the whole every row after this goes down inside. And he goes, I've never gone past the first row. And I thought to myself, Wow.

SPEAKER_01 37:47

It tells you a lot about behavior and perception, doesn't it? Yeah, yeah. No, that is that is amazing. Yeah. Uh oh gosh, yeah. I'm gonna remember that one. Um, you know what? I you know, as we kind of get towards the end here, I would I'd love to have you whip out your crystal ball because I know you're really you're you and and kind of what do you think? Give me there's lots of things we can anticipate about the future of this industry, but you know, think think for a moment, what do you think this business give me any you go in any direction you want? What do you what do you think there's gonna be different about this business in five years from now?

SPEAKER_00 38:26

Well, yeah. Um five years is is a tight window. You know, the other day I was trying to think nine nine years ahead, and and it was like it's it's it's hard also. You know, I I look at I look at the popularity of wash, dry, fold, pickup, and delivery. I l I see people laying out stores a little differently for that.

SPEAKER_01 38:50

Um like shaping the store more around the full serv the full service side, not just self-service, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:58

Yeah, I think that's the easiest win to say that that's gonna continue to evolve and and and really um take place. I I think the walk-in business will always kind of, or at least in five years we'll still be the bread and butter, but I I think we'll see more stores designed for for you know that other type of business, and it really is a different type of business, fundamentally like very labored intensive uh business. So so I I see people already like blocking off part where they open up the bulkhead and there's a there's a cool like thing that closes off part of the store, and now all the attendants are in that area, and and I think wow, that's that's a neat idea to adopt on but but maybe if we were laying that store out today, we would do it differently, knowing that they were gonna get so much Airbnb business in the future. And so I start I start thinking like along those terms, I see that I see a lot more use of AI, you know, um in the store, not just when you're doing the marketing of the store, which has really come a long way too. Um, and then further down the road, I mean, at some point, like more automation, uh, which is not a problem because I think laundromats has always been about automation anyway. So some disruption there. Um behind the Laundrelux booth at at Clean Show was this robotic folding company, which was I don't think it's I don't even think it's five years, I think it's still nine years.

SPEAKER_01 40:33

But it started, someone's someone's working on it.

SPEAKER_00 40:36

Yeah, I don't know that it's made any money yet, but at some point, you know, you we should keep an eye on that because it's it's labor is a big is a big issue. And so so I if if I had a you know crystal ball, I'd be looking at that. I think um the machines need to need to incorporate the manufacturers need to get on the on the AI wagon, you know, really. There's a there's a lot of things you can do there. Um and I'm sure they're working on it. The um uh you know, payments are are just getting better and better. The interfaces, the amount of times you have to touch it, the information that I mean I listen to like Alex its sense talking about information being important. He's he's right. I mean when I when I when I listen to him, that's one thing that I noticed at at Alliance too when I work there is they were getting excited about the CRM. Um and and it's like one thing to have the information, which which we're in that phase, like let's get it, let's get the information. Um but I think the next phase is what do we do with it? You know, how do we how do we predict things? How do we how do we decide, make decisions based on this? Um more than just a dashboard, what does it mean? What is it what does it mean for me? So I think I think uh you guys uh generate some really great reports, I've seen them, um, and I've heard customers love them and show them to me. And and I think I think that that side of the business is exciting. Um tying the ecosystem all together and making it more um connected is is really important. We're still very fragmented, you know, and in with technology, there's like 10 types of technology in each store. And so there's there's an opportunity there to open up APIs and things like that, I think. So what do you think? Well there it is.

SPEAKER_01 42:33

What do I think? Oh, I I think I think you, you know, there's there's a lot of directions to go here. And um, you know, I think the technology is gonna evolve. I mean, there's there's no way that it can't. I mean, there's there's a there's a tidal force that's causing us all to adopt some level of whether it be AI, automation, robotics, uh, you know, there's so many directions, and we're gonna do all of it, you know. I mean, the and I mean the CCI alone, but just as an industry, we are going to have to adopt those things. I think the things that I think that are gonna be more impactfully visible um just from an industry perspective, I think is goes back to some consolidation. But I think about more about what we're gonna see because that retail experience and and the stores. I'm seeing I'm seeing companies buy trying to buy so many stores right now, and they want to own not just five stores in their market, but we have these groups that want to own a hundred stores, 200 stores. And I think the technology is giving them the toolbox to actually be able to manage it. Because it's not the first time in the certainly in the 25 years I've been in this business that someone didn't say they were going to be the biggest laundromat operator in the country, but I'm not so sure we had the tools 25 years ago to make that a reality.

SPEAKER_00 43:49

We do, yeah. And and that's why the the clean cycles and uh whatever, you know, it uh did not take over the world back then. Um I think you know, at some scale they there was a lot of theft and there's a lot of mismanagement, and because there's there's still counting quarters. And and and I think today you you can do it with with the technology, with the right and and we're seeing that too. We're seeing a lot of PE money uh come in and and at least make a lot of bold, you know, promises that they're gonna do this and that. I I still still it's a very small part of our business still.

SPEAKER_01 44:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:27

Um and that that that in the next five years, I think you're right, it will probably grow. Um so you'll see to me.

SPEAKER_01 44:35

I think what we're gonna see there is I I'm my only thing that I'm um I don't know is whether they're gonna lose interest. Um because you know, when you compare the things that I think PE has gotten involved in historically, you look at all the business that they seem to have really made a major impact in, and I and we look at the profit margins that are behind that. Are they gonna lose interest in uh in the laundry industry? I don't know. I mean, but we you could also see a significant increase in what the profits are gonna be in this industry. That, you know, historically, because of so many small uh owners and operators, we see a hesitation to raise ven prices. You're not gonna see a corporate-owned type entity be afraid to raise their ven prices generally. You know, they're gonna make decisions based on what makes sense for that business surviving and being healthy and being that. And that that to some degree uh elevates our industry in general, right? I mean, the the more strong the Ven prices are, the more uh opportunities the investors and owners are gonna have to make the investments that we're asking them to make. So um, yeah, there's there's a lot of directions to go, whether it's five years or nine years, that's that's also up in the air when we see some of these changes. But um, but hey Jason, this is um actually exactly what I wanted to to happen with this interview. And um it this is um the kind of stuff that I think people need to hear. I appreciate you sharing uh all this knowledge, and I absolutely would love to have you come back and we'll have other topics that I think we'll will get into. But thank you for contributing this. It's been great to speak with you, and I look forward to talking to you again soon, men.

SPEAKER_00 46:11

Thanks, Steve. Thanks for having me. That was fun. We'll we'll definitely do it again. All right, awesome.